Thread: "Sixth solve of 3^7!"

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Speed only matter if you feel that it does. Now that I think about it
however, I'm wondering whether anyone would like the idea of holding a
3^7 speedsolving contest? That sounds much harder to me than finishing
an ultramarathon. Come to think of it, we could require that solvers
also run a full marathon at some point during their solve. Who's up for
this? It would certainly put chess boxing
to shame!

On 6/8/2015 11:35 AM, glenclark1973@gmail.com [4D_Cubing] wrote:
>
>
> I recently joined the group because I saw you were discussing my solve
> of the 3^7 cube. Thanks for the kind words from everyone. Do not read
> into the 96 hour total in in the log file because it program set idol
> for long periods. Macros were used for all pieces with more than 3
> colors. I will have to pay closer attention to the total time if I
> try to solve any other cubes.
> Glen


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">


Speed only matter if you feel that it does. Now that I think about
it however, I'm wondering whether anyone would like the idea of
holding a 3^7 speedsolving contest? That sounds much harder to me
than finishing an ultramarathon. Come to think of it, we could
require that solvers also run a full marathon at some point during
their solve. Who's up for this? It would certainly put href=3D"https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chess_boxing">chess boxing
to shame!

I recently joined the group because I saw you were discussing my
solve of the 3^7 cube.=C2=A0 Thanks for the kind words from everyone.=
=C2=A0
Do not read into the 96 hour total in in the log file because it
program set idol for long periods.=C2=A0 Macros were used for all
pieces with more than 3 colors.=C2=A0 I will have to pay closer
attention to the total time if I try to solve any other cubes.

Glen

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LOL, I don't blame you, Andrey. I struggle to understand how people do
find the time, and wonder if there are any limits to the lengths they
will go. It would appear that I'm getting close.

On 6/9/2015 1:07 AM, andreyastrelin@yahoo.com [4D_Cubing] wrote:
>
>
> I'm not in this game :) Time to Big Rip is too short to spend 70 hours
> for another solve of this monster :)
> Andrey
>


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">


LOL, I don't blame you, Andrey. I struggle to understand how people
do find the time, and wonder if there are any limits to the lengths
they will go. It would appear that I'm getting close.

I'm not in this game :) Time to Big=C2=A0Rip is too short to spe=
nd
70 hours for another=C2=A0solve of this monster=C2=A0:)

Andrey

=20

=20



=20=20


=20=20=20=20
=20=20=20=20=20=20
=20=20=20=20=20=20
=20=20=20=20=20=20
=20=20
=20=20
LOL, I don't blame you, Andrey. I struggle to understand how people
do find the time, and wonder if there are any limits to the lengths
they will go. It would appear that I'm getting close.

=20=20=20=20

=20=20=20=20
On 6/9/2015 1:07 AM,
andreyastrelin@yahoo.com [4D_Cubing] wrote:

=20=20=20=20
=20=20=20=20
=20=20=20=20=20=20
=20=20=20=20=20=20
I'm not in this game :) Time to Big Rip is too short to spend
70 hours for another solve of this monster :)
Andrey

=20=20=20=20=20=20
=20=20=20=20=20=20
=20=20=20=20=20=20
=20=20=20=20
=20=20=20=20

=20=20




=20=20=20=20
=20=20=20=20=20

=20=20=20=20
=20=20=20=20






=20=20=20=09=09=20=09=20=20=20=09=09=20=20
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I've actually found most of my math/computer-oriented co-workers to be
quite fascinated by this. It actually happened to me once that someone
at work came up to me and said, "I saw your name on a website about a 4D
Rubik's Cube puzzle. Was that you?" It's also happened before that
someone who googled for me (usually recruiters, maybe because of my open
source work or whatever) have specifically mentioned this as something
that piqued their interest. As a guy in his mid 40's working in an
office with a whole bunch of 20-somethings, being associated with
multidimensional puzzles of this sort has quite a bit of a "coolness
factor" to it. I gave a brown-bag session once on how to solve a regular
Rubik's cube without any memorized sequences using nothing more than
optional pencil and paper and one single method, and it was pretty
well-attended. Maybe I should do one using MC4D and see how it goes.
That's how I solved MC4D back in the early days (I was the second
solver). Among the math/computer crowd, I almost never hear, "But isn't
the fourth dimension time?" Non-math people often seem to say that a lot.

Unfortunately, I also have no more time to play with these puzzles. My
four-year-old twins take up all my time. I know some people with older
kids who have hobbies....

Jay (still lurking)

On 06/13/2015 06:35 PM, Melinda Green melinda@superliminal.com
[4D_Cubing] wrote:
>
>
> Math folks count. Most of those that I've explained it to get scared
> almost as often as the general public. Maybe for them they're worried
> that if they understand it, then they'll be required to solve them.
>
> For readers here wondering about this stuff, please try this
> experiment: Tell some people about the 4D cube and show it to them if
> you can. Especially try with some people with a fair amount of math.
> Then tell them that we also have 7D cubes as well as 3D hyperbolic and
> abstract polyhedra and let us know how they respond to that news. I've
> had people want to violently change the subject. It's really odd.
>
> On 6/13/2015 1:45 PM, Craig Durward craigdurward@hotmail.com
> [4D_Cubing] wrote:
>> There are only a few people I know that are interested in things like
>> this, and I can never get a coherent explanation together good enough
>> to explain things properly to them. The pictures help a lot, though.
>>
>> There was one who took enough interest to look at the websites on his
>> own - but he's a maths postgrad, so I feel like he almost doesn't count.
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To: 4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com
>> From: 4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com
>> Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2015 16:45:19 -0700
>> Subject: Re: [MC4D] Re: Sixth solve of 3^7!
>>
>>
>> I think that all of us here can relate to your story. What do your
>> friends and family think about it? I ask because I've found that when
>> talking about the 4D cube, people will often quake with a strange
>> sort of fear. Perhaps it's something like math phobia, I'm not really
>> sure, but when I've then described some of these other puzzles in
>> even higher dimensions and strange topologies, their minds seem to
>> implode and refuse to take in any more information. What's it like
>> when the lead-in to such a discussion is the 7D Rubik's cube?
>>
>>
>> On 6/12/2015 12:27 PM, Craig Durward craigdurward@hotmail.com
>> [4D_Cubing] wrote:
>>
>> Well, I did it after a lot of hesitation. I remember thinking I'd
>> never bother to finish it, but once I get so far with something
>> I'm loathe to let it go, no matter how long it takes.
>>
>> As for where the time comes from: I did it just after the birth
>> of my son. The only way we could get him to settle in those days
>> was when he was asleep on someone, so I thought I might as well
>> try it if I was going to be confined to a chair for long periods
>> of time. I had plenty of time to do it before he grew out of that
>> phase (unfortunately for me and his mum).
>>
>> He (and his baby brother) is a bit more demanding of my time now
>> - I barely have time to do a 3^3, never mind a 3^7.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>>
>> Craig
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To: 4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com
>> From: 4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com
>> Date: Tue, 9 Jun 2015 03:06:59 -0700
>> Subject: Re: [MC4D] Re: Sixth solve of 3^7!
>>
>>
>> LOL, I don't blame you, Andrey. I struggle to understand how
>> people do find the time, and wonder if there are any limits to
>> the lengths they will go. It would appear that I'm getting close.
>>
>>
>> On 6/9/2015 1:07 AM, andreyastrelin@yahoo.com
>> [4D_Cubing] wrote:
>>
>> I'm not in this game :) Time to Big Rip is too short to spend
>> 70 hours for another solve of this monster :)
>> Andrey
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>


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I've actually found most of my math/computer-oriented co-workers to
be quite fascinated by this. It actually happened to me once that
someone at work came up to me and said, "I saw your name on a
website about a 4D Rubik's Cube puzzle. Was that you?" It's also
happened before that someone who googled for me (usually recruiters,
maybe because of my open source work or whatever) have specifically
mentioned this as something that piqued their interest. As a guy in
his mid 40's working in an office with a whole bunch of
20-somethings, being associated with multidimensional puzzles of
this sort has quite a bit of a "coolness factor" to it. I gave a
brown-bag session once on how to solve a regular Rubik's cube
without any memorized sequences using nothing more than optional
pencil and paper and one single method, and it was pretty
well-attended. Maybe I should do one using MC4D and see how it goes.
That's how I solved MC4D back in the early days (I was the second
solver). Among the math/computer crowd, I almost never hear, "But
isn't the fourth dimension time?" Non-math people often seem to say
that a lot.



Unfortunately, I also have no more time to play with these puzzles.
My four-year-old twins take up all my time. I know some people with
older kids who have hobbies....



Jay (still lurking)

 

Math folks count. Most of those that I've explained it
to get scared almost as often as the general public. Maybe
for them they're worried that if they understand it, then
they'll be required to solve them.



For readers here wondering about this stuff, please try
this experiment: Tell some people about the 4D cube and
show it to them if you can. Especially try with some
people with a fair amount of math. Then tell them that we
also have 7D cubes as well as 3D hyperbolic and abstract
polyhedra and let us know how they respond to that news.
I've had people want to violently change the subject. It's
really odd.

On 6/13/2015 1:45 PM, Craig
Durward class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:craigdurward@hotmail.com">craigdurward@hotmail.com
[4D_Cubing] wrote:

cite="mid:DUB127-W692B88106A712EF86F7042D2BA0@phx.gbl"
type="cite">

There are only a few people I know that are
interested in things like this, and I can never get a
coherent explanation together good enough to explain
things properly to them. The pictures help a lot,
though.

There was one who took enough interest to look at
the websites on his own - but he's a maths postgrad,
so I feel like he almost doesn't count.

---

To: moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com">4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com

From: class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com">4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com

Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2015 16:45:19 -0700

Subject: Re: [MC4D] Re: Sixth solve of 3^7!



 

I think that all of us
here can relate to your story. What do your
friends and family think about it? I ask
because I've found that when talking about
the 4D cube, people will often quake with a
strange sort of fear. Perhaps it's something
like math phobia, I'm not really sure, but
when I've then described some of these other
puzzles in even higher dimensions and
strange topologies, their minds seem to
implode and refuse to take in any more
information. What's it like when the lead-in
to such a discussion is the 7D Rubik's cube?

On 6/12/2015
12:27 PM, Craig Durward moz-do-not-send="true" moz="true"
class="ecxmoz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:craigdurward@hotmail.com">craigdurward@hotmail.com
[4D_Cubing] wrote:

cite="mid:DUB127-W442C62788C4D24C6DD561DD2BB0@phx.gbl">

Well, I did it after a lot of
hesitation. I remember thinking I'd
never bother to finish it, but once I
get so far with something I'm loathe
to let it go, no matter how long it
takes.

As for where the time comes from: I did
it just after the birth of my son. The
only way we could get him to settle in
those days was when he was asleep on
someone, so I thought I might as well
try it if I was going to be confined to
a chair for long periods of time. I had
plenty of time to do it before he grew
out of that phase (unfortunately for me
and his mum).

He (and his baby brother) is a bit
more demanding of my time now - I
barely have time to do a 3^3, never
mind a 3^7.

Cheers,

Craig

---

To: moz-do-not-send="true" moz="true"
class="ecxmoz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com">4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com

From: moz="true"
class="ecxmoz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com">4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com

Date: Tue, 9 Jun 2015 03:06:59 -0700

Subject: Re: [MC4D] Re: Sixth solve
of 3^7!



 

LOL, I
don't blame you, Andrey. I
struggle to understand how
people do find the time, and
wonder if there are any limits
to the lengths they will go.
It would appear that I'm
getting close.





class="ecxmoz-cite-prefix">On

6/9/2015 1:07 AM, moz-do-not-send="true"
moz="true"
class="ecxmoz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:andreyastrelin@yahoo.com">andreyastrelin@yahoo.com
[4D_Cubing] wrote:

cite="mid:ml66sn+1sb1rf7@YahooGroups.com">

I'm not in this game :)
Time to Big Rip is too
short to spend 70 hours
for another solve of this
monster :)

Andrey

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Great to hear from you, Jay!

For those who don't know, Jay is as much responsible for the success of=20
our code as anyone. He came along at a point where Don Hatch (my=20
co-author) and I were stuck. The code was too much of a mess for either=20
of us feel good about publishing, and neither of us was willing to do=20
the messy job of getting it to that point. Like an angel, Jay came along=20
and said that he'd do it, and he did!

I agree that having solved or worked on MC4D gives you a great talking=20
point and street cred, I was more interested to hear what people then=20
say after you mention MC7D or other monsters. I find people generally=20
willing to talk about the 4D puzzle but giving them even an inkling into=20
just how deep this rabbit hole goes causes them to completely shut down.=20
There seems to be a limit to just how much awesome one brain can hold at=20
a time.

On 6/13/2015 4:08 PM, Jay Berkenbilt ejb@ql.org [4D_Cubing] wrote:
>
>
> I've actually found most of my math/computer-oriented co-workers to be=20
> quite fascinated by this. It actually happened to me once that someone=20
> at work came up to me and said, "I saw your name on a website about a=20
> 4D Rubik's Cube puzzle. Was that you?" It's also happened before that=20
> someone who googled for me (usually recruiters, maybe because of my=20
> open source work or whatever) have specifically mentioned this as=20
> something that piqued their interest. As a guy in his mid 40's working=20
> in an office with a whole bunch of 20-somethings, being associated=20
> with multidimensional puzzles of this sort has quite a bit of a=20
> "coolness factor" to it. I gave a brown-bag session once on how to=20
> solve a regular Rubik's cube without any memorized sequences using=20
> nothing more than optional pencil and paper and one single method, and=20
> it was pretty well-attended. Maybe I should do one using MC4D and see=20
> how it goes. That's how I solved MC4D back in the early days (I was=20
> the second solver). Among the math/computer crowd, I almost never=20
> hear, "But isn't the fourth dimension time?" Non-math people often=20
> seem to say that a lot.
>
> Unfortunately, I also have no more time to play with these puzzles. My=20
> four-year-old twins take up all my time. I know some people with older=20
> kids who have hobbies....
>
> Jay (still lurking)
>
> On 06/13/2015 06:35 PM, Melinda Green melinda@superliminal.com=20
> [4D_Cubing] wrote:
>>
>> Math folks count. Most of those that I've explained it to get scared=20
>> almost as often as the general public. Maybe for them they're worried=20
>> that if they understand it, then they'll be required to solve them.
>>
>> For readers here wondering about this stuff, please try this=20
>> experiment: Tell some people about the 4D cube and show it to them if=20
>> you can. Especially try with some people with a fair amount of math.=20
>> Then tell them that we also have 7D cubes as well as 3D hyperbolic=20
>> and abstract polyhedra and let us know how they respond to that news.=20
>> I've had people want to violently change the subject. It's really odd.
>>
>> On 6/13/2015 1:45 PM, Craig Durward craigdurward@hotmail.com=20
>> [4D_Cubing] wrote:
>>> There are only a few people I know that are interested in things=20
>>> like this, and I can never get a coherent explanation together good=20
>>> enough to explain things properly to them. The pictures help a lot,=20
>>> though.
>>>
>>> There was one who took enough interest to look at the websites on=20
>>> his own - but he's a maths postgrad, so I feel like he almost=20
>>> doesn't count.
>>>
>>> -----------------------------------------------------------------------=
-
>>> To: 4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com
>>> From: 4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com
>>> Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2015 16:45:19 -0700
>>> Subject: Re: [MC4D] Re: Sixth solve of 3^7!
>>>
>>> I think that all of us here can relate to your story. What do your=20
>>> friends and family think about it? I ask because I've found that=20
>>> when talking about the 4D cube, people will often quake with a=20
>>> strange sort of fear. Perhaps it's something like math phobia, I'm=20
>>> not really sure, but when I've then described some of these other=20
>>> puzzles in even higher dimensions and strange topologies, their=20
>>> minds seem to implode and refuse to take in any more information.=20
>>> What's it like when the lead-in to such a discussion is the 7D=20
>>> Rubik's cube?
>>>
>>>
>>> On 6/12/2015 12:27 PM, Craig Durward craigdurward@hotmail.com=20
>>> [4D_Cubing] wrote:
>>>
>>> Well, I did it after a lot of hesitation. I remember thinking
>>> I'd never bother to finish it, but once I get so far with
>>> something I'm loathe to let it go, no matter how long it takes.
>>>
>>> As for where the time comes from: I did it just after the birth
>>> of my son. The only way we could get him to settle in those days
>>> was when he was asleep on someone, so I thought I might as well
>>> try it if I was going to be confined to a chair for long periods
>>> of time. I had plenty of time to do it before he grew out of
>>> that phase (unfortunately for me and his mum).
>>>
>>> He (and his baby brother) is a bit more demanding of my time now
>>> - I barely have time to do a 3^3, never mind a 3^7.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>>
>>> Craig
>>>
>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------=
-----
>>> To: 4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com
>>> From: 4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com
>>> Date: Tue, 9 Jun 2015 03:06:59 -0700
>>> Subject: Re: [MC4D] Re: Sixth solve of 3^7!
>>>
>>> LOL, I don't blame you, Andrey. I struggle to understand how
>>> people do find the time, and wonder if there are any limits to
>>> the lengths they will go. It would appear that I'm getting close.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 6/9/2015 1:07 AM, andreyastrelin@yahoo.com
>>> [4D_Cubing] wrote:
>>>
>>> I'm not in this game :) Time to Big Rip is too short to
>>> spend 70 hours for another solve of this monster :)
>>> Andrey
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
>
>=20


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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable



http-equiv=3D"Content-Type">


Great to hear from you, Jay!



For those who don't know, Jay is as much responsible for the success
of our code as anyone. He came along at a point where Don Hatch (my
co-author) and I were stuck. The code was too much of a mess for
either of us feel good about publishing, and neither of us was
willing to do the messy job of getting it to that point. Like an
angel, Jay came along and said that he'd do it, and he did!



I agree that having solved or worked on MC4D gives you a great
talking point and street cred, I was more interested to hear what
people then say after you mention MC7D or other monsters. I find
people generally willing to talk about the 4D puzzle but giving them
even an inkling into just how deep this rabbit hole goes causes them
to completely shut down. There seems to be a limit to just how much
awesome one brain can hold at a time.

http-equiv=3D"Content-Type">
I've actually found most of
my math/computer-oriented co-workers to be quite fascinated by
this. It actually happened to me once that someone at work came up
to me and said, "I saw your name on a website about a 4D Rubik's
Cube puzzle. Was that you?" It's also happened before that someone
who googled for me (usually recruiters, maybe because of my open
source work or whatever) have specifically mentioned this as
something that piqued their interest. As a guy in his mid 40's
working in an office with a whole bunch of 20-somethings, being
associated with multidimensional puzzles of this sort has quite a
bit of a "coolness factor" to it. I gave a brown-bag session once
on how to solve a regular Rubik's cube without any memorized
sequences using nothing more than optional pencil and paper and
one single method, and it was pretty well-attended. Maybe I should
do one using MC4D and see how it goes. That's how I solved MC4D
back in the early days (I was the second solver). Among the
math/computer crowd, I almost never hear, "But isn't the fourth
dimension time?" Non-math people often seem to say that a lot.



Unfortunately, I also have no more time to play with these
puzzles. My four-year-old twins take up all my time. I know some
people with older kids who have hobbies....



Jay (still lurking)

On 06/13/2015 06:35 PM, Melinda Green
href=3D"mailto:melinda@superliminal.com">melinda@superliminal.com=

[4D_Cubing] wrote:

type=3D"cite"> =A0

Math folks count. Most of those that I've explained it to
get scared almost as often as the general public. Maybe for
them they're worried that if they understand it, then
they'll be required to solve them.



For readers here wondering about this stuff, please try this
experiment: Tell some people about the 4D cube and show it
to them if you can. Especially try with some people with a
fair amount of math. Then tell them that we also have 7D
cubes as well as 3D hyperbolic and abstract polyhedra and
let us know how they respond to that news. I've had people
want to violently change the subject. It's really odd.

On 6/13/2015 1:45 PM, Craig
Durward class=3D"moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href=3D"mailto:craigdurward@hotmail.com">craigdurward@hotmail=
.com
[4D_Cubing] wrote:

cite=3D"mid:DUB127-W692B88106A712EF86F7042D2BA0@phx.gbl"
type=3D"cite">

There are only a few people I know that are
interested in things like this, and I can never get a
coherent explanation together good enough to explain
things properly to them. The pictures help a lot, though.

There was one who took enough interest to look at
the websites on his own - but he's a maths postgrad,
so I feel like he almost doesn't count.

---

To: class=3D"moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href=3D"mailto:4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com">4D_Cubing@y=
ahoogroups.com

From: class=3D"moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href=3D"mailto:4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com">4D_Cubing@y=
ahoogroups.com

Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2015 16:45:19 -0700

Subject: Re: [MC4D] Re: Sixth solve of 3^7!



=A0

I think that all of us
here can relate to your story. What do your
friends and family think about it? I ask
because I've found that when talking about the
4D cube, people will often quake with a
strange sort of fear. Perhaps it's something
like math phobia, I'm not really sure, but
when I've then described some of these other
puzzles in even higher dimensions and strange
topologies, their minds seem to implode and
refuse to take in any more information. What's
it like when the lead-in to such a discussion
is the 7D Rubik's cube?

On 6/12/2015
12:27 PM, Craig Durward moz-do-not-send=3D"true" moz=3D"true"
class=3D"ecxmoz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href=3D"mailto:craigdurward@hotmail.com">crai=
gdurward@hotmail.com
[4D_Cubing] wrote:

cite=3D"mid:DUB127-W442C62788C4D24C6DD561DD2BB0=
@phx.gbl">

Well, I did it after a lot of
hesitation. I remember thinking I'd
never bother to finish it, but once I
get so far with something I'm loathe to
let it go, no matter how long it takes.v>

As for where the time comes from: I did it
just after the birth of my son. The only
way we could get him to settle in those
days was when he was asleep on someone, so
I thought I might as well try it if I was
going to be confined to a chair for long
periods of time. I had plenty of time to
do it before he grew out of that phase
(unfortunately for me and his mum).

He (and his baby brother) is a bit
more demanding of my time now - I barely
have time to do a 3^3, never mind a 3^7.iv>

Cheers,

Craig

---

To: moz-do-not-send=3D"true" moz=3D"true"
class=3D"ecxmoz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href=3D"mailto:4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com">4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com

From: moz=3D"true"
class=3D"ecxmoz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href=3D"mailto:4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com">4D_Cubing@yahoogroups.com

Date: Tue, 9 Jun 2015 03:06:59 -0700

Subject: Re: [MC4D] Re: Sixth solve of
3^7!



=A0

LOL, I
don't blame you, Andrey. I
struggle to understand how
people do find the time, and
wonder if there are any limits
to the lengths they will go. It
would appear that I'm getting
close.

O=
n


6/9/2015 1:07 AM, moz-do-not-send=3D"true"
moz=3D"true"
class=3D"ecxmoz-txt-link-abbrev=
iated"
href=3D"mailto:andreyastrelin@yahoo.com">andreyastrelin@yahoo.com
[4D_Cubing] wrote:

cite=3D"mid:ml66sn+1sb1rf7@YahooG=
roups.com">

I'm not in this game :)
Time to Big=A0Rip is too short
to spend 70 hours for
another=A0solve of this
monster=A0:)

Andrey